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    Take a look at this...Notice the Theo and Actual for Cir 3....X is .0012 off and Y is -.0008 off. Now look at the True Position X and Y Actuals. What's the deal here?


    CIR3 =FEAT/CIRCLE,RECT,OUT,LEAST_SQR
    THEO/0,0,0.7468,0,0,1,5
    ACTL/0.0012,-0.0008,0.7468,0,0,1,4.9833
    MEAS/CIRCLE,5,WORKPLANE
    MOVE/POINT,NORMAL,2.8428,1.2012,0.757
    MOVE/POINT,NORMAL,2.8427,1.2011,1.8004
    MOVE/POINT,NORMAL,2.7909,-0.7536,1.8097
    MOVE/POINT,NORMAL,2.5481,-0.9753,0.7445
    MOVE/CIRCULAR
    MOVE/CIRCULAR
    MOVE/CIRCULAR
    MOVE/CIRCULAR
    MOVE/POINT,NORMAL,-2.7945,-1.3987,0.7442
    ENDMEAS/
    DIM LOC1= TRUE POSITION OF CIRCLE CIR3 UNITS=IN ,$
    GRAPH=OFF TEXT=OFF MULT=10.00 OUTPUT=BOTH DEV PERPEN CENTERLINE=OFF DISPLAY=DIAMETER
    AX MEAS NOMINAL +TOL -TOL BONUS DEV OUTTOL
    X 0.0012 0.0000 0.0012
    Y 0.0102 0.0000 0.0102
    DF 4.9833 5.0000 0.0000 0.0300 -0.0167 0.0000 #
    D1 PLANE PLN1 AT RFS
    D2 LINE LIN1 AT RFS
    D3 4.9973 5.0000 0.0100 0.0100 0.0127 CIRCLE DAT_B AT MMC
    TP RFS 0.0000 0.0104 0.0205 0.0101 >
    END OF DIMENSION LOC1
    ~Josh~ Giles Rescue "Ut ceteri vivant"

  • #2
    You are using the datum modifiers right? You are recalling them incorrectly. It should be like a 3-2-1 alignment hence pln, circle, line.
    Last edited by JamesMannes; 06-15-2007, 10:57 AM. Reason: messed up my order of recalling datums. Duh!!
    sigpic

    James Mannes

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    • #3
      I'm not sure I follow you...Yes, I have use datums checked...i clicked my feature first...then plane, then, line, then my origin.
      ~Josh~ Giles Rescue "Ut ceteri vivant"

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      • #4
        Did you use DATUMS in the TP? Don't. Make an alignment to the datums for the TP dimension, then just do the TP dimension. And, at the same time, report a regualr dim-locaiton of the hole. They will match. Pcdmis will slide and shift your alignment around when using datums/MMC in the TP dimension.
        sigpic
        Originally posted by AndersI
        I've got one from September 2006 (bug ticket) which has finally been fixed in 2013.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Matthew D. Hoedeman View Post
          Did you use DATUMS in the TP? Don't. Make an alignment to the datums for the TP dimension, then just do the TP dimension. And, at the same time, report a regualr dim-locaiton of the hole. They will match. Pcdmis will slide and shift your alignment around when using datums/MMC in the TP dimension.
          So, uncheck Use Datums? Yes, I am aligned to my datums already. This is a MMC TP. What if its out of tol. and the MMC would bring it in?
          ~Josh~ Giles Rescue "Ut ceteri vivant"

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          • #6
            Originally posted by jkb_mcg View Post
            I'm not sure I follow you...Yes, I have use datums checked...i clicked my feature first...then plane, then, line, then my origin.
            Sorry I typed too fast. It should be plane, circle, line. Edited other post to fix my fux pux.
            3=primary(plane levelind/origin 1 axeis), 2=secondary(circle 0,0), 1=tertiary(rotation?)
            Last edited by JamesMannes; 06-15-2007, 10:59 AM.
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            James Mannes

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            • #7
              FIX IT!

              Well, that is one option. If you are that border-line, it probably SHOULD get fixed.

              HOWEVER, you can add teh MMC from the datum by using assignments. Assign the bonus from the datum hole to V1 and assign V2=TP tol + V1 and when you tolerance the TP, after the dimension is created, put V2 in for the tolerance. I think that should work. HOWEVER, when looking at the dimension in ANYTHING other than report mode, it will show you V2 for the tolerance, report mode should show the value. The assignment will need to be marked.
              sigpic
              Originally posted by AndersI
              I've got one from September 2006 (bug ticket) which has finally been fixed in 2013.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Matthew D. Hoedeman View Post
                FIX IT!

                Well, that is one option. If you are that border-line, it probably SHOULD get fixed.

                HOWEVER, you can add teh MMC from the datum by using assignments. Assign the bonus from the datum hole to V1 and assign V2=TP tol + V1 and when you tolerance the TP, after the dimension is created, put V2 in for the tolerance. I think that should work. HOWEVER, when looking at the dimension in ANYTHING other than report mode, it will show you V2 for the tolerance, report mode should show the value. The assignment will need to be marked.
                I don't hardly ever use assignments but I'll give it a shot! THX!
                ~Josh~ Giles Rescue "Ut ceteri vivant"

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by JamesMannes View Post
                  Sorry I typed too fast. It should be plane, circle, line. Edited other post to fix my fux pux.
                  3=primary(plane levelind/origin 1 axeis), 2=secondary(circle 0,0), 1=tertiary(rotation?)
                  That worked! Thanks! It's just hard to believe that by putting them in a different order is going to change them .018!!!
                  ~Josh~ Giles Rescue "Ut ceteri vivant"

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                  • #10
                    Here take a look at this.
                    Last edited by JamesMannes; 08-03-2007, 08:27 AM.
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                    James Mannes

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Matthew D. Hoedeman View Post
                      HOWEVER, you can add teh MMC from the datum by using assignments. Assign the bonus from the datum hole to V1 and assign V2=TP tol + V1 and when you tolerance the TP, after the dimension is created, put V2 in for the tolerance. I think that should work. HOWEVER, when looking at the dimension in ANYTHING other than report mode, it will show you V2 for the tolerance, report mode should show the value. The assignment will need to be marked.
                      While this is not correct GD&T it is one of the "DEMON work arounds" that you can use to get MMC bonus. I had a part in an older program that give perfect, zero deviation on the features toleranced using datums and applying MMC. It would show no deviation from nominal until I quit using the datums.
                      Xcel & MicroVal Pfx & Global 37mr4 thru 2012mr1sp3
                      Contura Calypso 5.4

                      Lord, keep Your arm around my shoulder and Your hand over my mouth. Amen.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by JamesMannes View Post
                        Here take a look at this.
                        Cool. Thanks! Do these Newsletters still come out? I haven't gotten one for quite some time.
                        ~Josh~ Giles Rescue "Ut ceteri vivant"

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by jkb_mcg View Post
                          Cool. Thanks! Do these Newsletters still come out? I haven't gotten one for quite some time.
                          It's like quarterly at best.
                          sigpic

                          James Mannes

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by dwade View Post
                            While this is not correct GD&T it is one of the "DEMON work arounds" that you can use to get MMC bonus. I had a part in an older program that give perfect, zero deviation on the features toleranced using datums and applying MMC. It would show no deviation from nominal until I quit using the datums.
                            That is because Pcdmis, when using MMC on the datums, treats it like a hard-gage and slides the alignment around so that the deviation of the TP feature is as close to zero as possible. So, if your datum holes are (and CAN BE!) 0.5mm bigger than minimum, then your alignment could be shifted up to 0.25mm in either direction, placing the EDGE of the datum holes on the edge of a minimum-size locator pin, more or less.
                            sigpic
                            Originally posted by AndersI
                            I've got one from September 2006 (bug ticket) which has finally been fixed in 2013.

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