Getting all zeros with true position

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  • Getting all zeros with true position

    Hello all, I just updated to 2021.1, and I'm not sure if that's why I'm experiencing this issue, but when I don't use legacy dimensions, PC-DMIS is reporting 0.000 for all values on true position. However, if I pull up location or use legacy dimensions, it seems to be reporting the actual dimensions. I'm defining my datums to the same features I'm aligned to. I've been trying to wrap my head around this for a couple hours now and can't figure out any reason this might be happening. I've only been doing this for about a year. Maybe I'm missing something? Any help is appreciated.

    Thanks!

    Code and snapshot follow below:

    Code:
    LOADPROBE/1MMX20MM_20MM
    TIP/T1A0B0, SHANKIJK=0, 0, 1, ANGLE=0
    COMMENT/OPER,NO,FULL SCREEN=YES,AUTO-CONTINUE=NO,
    SET PART ON TOP OF MAGNETIC POST WITH
    DATUM A FACING UP.
    
    POSITION PROBE IN CENTER OF PART APPROX.
    1/8" FROM TOP OF PART, THEN PRESS OK.
    
    START =FEAT/POINT,CARTESIAN
    THEO/<0,0,0.42>,<0,0,1>
    ACTL/<24.2878,6.4513,-32.2275>,<0,0,1>
    READPOINT/
    
    POINT_ALIGN=ALIGNMENT/START,RECALL:STARTUP,LIST=YES
    ALIGNMENT/TRANS,XAXIS,START
    ALIGNMENT/TRANS,YAXIS,START
    ALIGNMENT/TRANS,ZAXIS,START
    ALIGNMENT/TRANS_OFFSET,ZAXIS,-0.42
    ALIGNMENT/END
    
    COMMENT/OPER,NO,FULL SCREEN=NO,AUTO-CONTINUE=NO,
    BEGINNING DCC OPERATIONS!
    
    MODE/DCC
    
    MAN_DATUM_A=FEAT/CONTACT/PLANE/DEFAULT,CARTESIAN,TRIANGLE,LEAST_SQR
    THEO/<0,0,0>,<0,0,1>
    ACTL/<0.0004,-0.0001,-0.02>,<-0.004771,0.0003777,0.9999885>
    TARG/<0,0,0>,<0,0,1>
    ANGLE VEC=<0,-1,0>,RADIAL
    SHOW FEATURE PARAMETERS=NO
    SHOW CONTACT PARAMETERS=NO
    
    A1 =ALIGNMENT/START,RECALL:POINT_ALIGN,LIST=YES
    ALIGNMENT/TRANS,ZAXIS,MAN_DATUM_A
    ALIGNMENT/END
    
    MAN_DATUM_B=FEAT/CONTACT/CIRCLE/DEFAULT,CARTESIAN,OUT,LEAST_SQR
    THEO/<0,0,0.065>,<0,0,1>,0.25,0
    ACTL/<0.0018,-0.0002,0.065>,<0,0,1>,0.2428,0
    TARG/<0,0,0.065>,<0,0,1>
    START ANG=0,END ANG=360
    ANGLE VEC=<-1,0,0>
    DIRECTION=CCW
    SHOW FEATURE PARAMETERS=NO
    SHOW CONTACT PARAMETERS=NO
    
    MAN_ALIGN =ALIGNMENT/START,RECALL:STARTUP,LIST=YES
    ALIGNMENT/LEVEL,ZPLUS,MAN_DATUM_A
    ALIGNMENT/TRANS,ZAXIS,MAN_DATUM_A
    ALIGNMENT/TRANS,XAXIS,MAN_DATUM_B
    ALIGNMENT/TRANS,YAXIS,MAN_DATUM_B
    ALIGNMENT/END
    
    DATUM_A =FEAT/CONTACT/PLANE/DEFAULT,CARTESIAN,TRIANGLE,LEAST_SQR
    THEO/<0,0,0>,<0,0,1>
    ACTL/<0,0,0.0003>,<0.0009968,-0.0002343,0.9999995>
    TARG/<0,0,0>,<0,0,1>
    ANGLE VEC=<0,1,0>,RADIAL
    SHOW FEATURE PARAMETERS=NO
    SHOW CONTACT PARAMETERS=NO
    
    DATUM_B_CYL=FEAT/CONTACT/CYLINDER/ADAPTIVE_CYLINDER_SPIRAL_SCAN,CARTESIAN,OUT,LEAST_ SQR
    THEO/<0,0,0.27>,<0,0,1>,0.25,-0.205
    ACTL/<-0.0004,-0.0001,0.27>,<0.0009065,0.0010396,0.999999>,0.2468 ,-0.205
    TARG/<0,0,0.27>,<0,0,1>
    START ANG=0,END ANG=360
    ANGLE VEC=<0,1,0>
    DIRECTION=CW
    SHOW FEATURE PARAMETERS=NO
    SHOW CONTACT PARAMETERS=NO
    
    DATUM_B_CIR=FEAT/CONTACT/CIRCLE/ADAPTIVE_CIRCLE_SCAN,CARTESIAN,OUT,LEAST_SQR
    THEO/<0,0,0.27>,<0,0,1>,0.25,0
    ACTL/<-0.0002,0.0002,0.27>,<0,0,1>,0.2404,0
    TARG/<0,0,0.27>,<0,0,1>
    START ANG=0,END ANG=360
    ANGLE VEC=<0,-1,0>
    DIRECTION=CCW
    SHOW FEATURE PARAMETERS=NO
    SHOW CONTACT PARAMETERS=NO
    
    AB_ALIGN =ALIGNMENT/START,RECALL:STARTUP,LIST=YES
    ALIGNMENT/LEVEL,ZPLUS,DATUM_A
    ALIGNMENT/TRANS,ZAXIS,DATUM_A
    ALIGNMENT/TRANS,XAXIS,DATUM_B_CIR
    ALIGNMENT/TRANS,YAXIS,DATUM_B_CIR
    ALIGNMENT/END
    
    DATDEF/A,FEATURES=DATUM_A,,
    DATDEF/B,FEATURES=DATUM_B_CIR,,
    
    .054_PLN =FEAT/CONTACT/PLANE/DEFAULT,CARTESIAN,TRIANGLE,LEAST_SQR
    THEO/<0,0,-0.054>,<0,0,1>
    ACTL/<0.0003,-0.0001,-0.0532>,<-0.0000489,-0.0001275,1>
    TARG/<0,0,-0.054>,<0,0,1>
    ANGLE VEC=<0,-1,0>,RADIAL
    SHOW FEATURE PARAMETERS=NO
    SHOW CONTACT PARAMETERS=NO
    
    COMMENT/REPT,
    (10) .053 - .055 LINEAR DIMENSION (D2)
    
    DIM DIST1= 3D DISTANCE FROM PLANE DATUM_A TO PLANE .054_PLN,SHORTEST=OFF,NO_RADIUS UNITS=IN,$
    GRAPH=OFF TEXT=OFF MULT=10.00 OUTPUT=BOTH
    AX MEAS NOMINAL +TOL -TOL MAX MIN DEV OUTTOL
    M 0.0532 0.0540 0.0010 0.0010 0.0549 0.0524 -0.0008 0.0000 -#-------
    
    PREHIT/0.01
    RETRACT/0.01
    
    .464_ID =FEAT/CONTACT/CIRCLE/ADAPTIVE_CIRCLE_SCAN,CARTESIAN,IN,LEAST_SQR
    THEO/<0,0,0>,<0,0,1>,0.464
    ACTL/<-0.005,-0.0015,0>,<0,0,1>,0.4651
    TARG/<0,0,0>,<0,0,1>
    START ANG=0,END ANG=360
    ANGLE VEC=<0,-1,0>
    DIRECTION=CCW
    SHOW FEATURE PARAMETERS=NO
    SHOW CONTACT PARAMETERS=NO
    
    COMMENT/REPT,
    (14) .464 DIAMETER ± .004 (C3)
    (15) .000 TRUE POSITION (LMC) TO DATUMS A, B(M) (C3)
    
    FCFLOC1 =GEOMETRIC_TOLERANCE/STANDARD=ASME Y14.5,SHOWEXPANDED=YES,
    FEATURE_MATH=DEFAULT,DATUM_MATH=DEFAULT,DISPLAY_CO ORDS=DRF,
    UNITS=IN,OUTPUT=BOTH,ARROWDENSITY=100,
    SIZE/NOMINAL=0.464,UPPER TOLERANCE=0.004,LOWER TOLERANCE=0.004,
    REPORT_LOCAL_SIZE=OFF,
    .464_ID:
    UAME SIZE:0.4644,
    SEGMENT_1,POSITION,DIAMETER,0,LMC,A,B,MMB,<size>,_ _,<dat>,
    TEXT=OFF,CADGRAPH=OFF,REPORTGRAPH=OFF,MULT=10,
    MEASURED:
    .464_ID:0.0000,
    ADD
    DATUMS/REPORTDATUMSIZE=OFF,
    B(DATUM_B_CIR):NOM=0.25,+Tol=0.0004,-Tol=0.0004,
    FEATURES/.464_ID,,
    
    COMMENT/REPT,
    Actual location of above feature
    
    DIM LOC1= LOCATION OF CIRCLE .464_ID UNITS=IN ,$
    GRAPH=OFF TEXT=OFF MULT=10.00 OUTPUT=BOTH HALF ANGLE=NO
    AX MEAS NOMINAL +TOL -TOL MAX MIN DEV OUTTOL
    X -0.0050 0.0000 0.0050 0.0050 0.2278 -0.2379 -0.0050 0.0000 #--------
    Y -0.0015 0.0000 0.0050 0.0050 0.2308 -0.2338 -0.0015 0.0000 ---#-----
    D 0.4651 0.4640 0.0040 0.0040 0.0000 0.0000 0.0011 0.0000 -----#---
    END OF DIMENSION LOC1
    
    COMMENT/REPT,
    True position using legacy dimensions:
    
    DIM LOC3= POSITION OF CIRCLE .464_ID UNITS=IN ,$
    GRAPH=OFF TEXT=OFF MULT=10.00 OUTPUT=BOTH FIT TO DATUMS=OFF DEV PERPEN CENTERLINE=OFF DISPLAY=DIAMETER
    AX MEAS NOMINAL +TOL -TOL BONUS DEV OUTTOL
    X -0.0050 0.0000 -0.0050
    Y -0.0015 0.0000 -0.0015
    DF 0.4651 0.4640 0.0040 0.0040 0.0029 0.0011 0.0000 -----#---
    TP 0.0104 LMC 0.0000 0.0029 0.0104 0.0075 -------->
    END OF DIMENSION LOC3
    
    .540_OD =FEAT/CONTACT/CIRCLE/ADAPTIVE_CIRCLE_SCAN,CARTESIAN,OUT,LEAST_SQR
    THEO/<0,0,0>,<0,0,1>,0.54,0
    ACTL/<-0.005,-0.0013,0>,<0,0,1>,0.5392,0
    TARG/<0,0,0>,<0,0,1>
    START ANG=0,END ANG=360
    ANGLE VEC=<0,-1,0>
    DIRECTION=CCW
    SHOW FEATURE PARAMETERS=NO
    SHOW CONTACT PARAMETERS=NO
    
    COMMENT/REPT,
    (17) .540 DIAMETER ± .005 (B1)
    (18) .000 TRUE POSITION (LMC) TO DATUMS A, B(M) (B1)
    
    FCFLOC2 =GEOMETRIC_TOLERANCE/STANDARD=ASME Y14.5,SHOWEXPANDED=YES,
    FEATURE_MATH=DEFAULT,DATUM_MATH=DEFAULT,DISPLAY_CO ORDS=DRF,
    UNITS=IN,OUTPUT=BOTH,ARROWDENSITY=100,
    SIZE/NOMINAL=0.54,UPPER TOLERANCE=0.005,LOWER TOLERANCE=0.005,
    REPORT_LOCAL_SIZE=OFF,
    .540_OD:
    UAME SIZE:0.5395,
    SEGMENT_1,POSITION,DIAMETER,0,LMC,A,B,MMB,<size>,_ _,<dat>,
    TEXT=OFF,CADGRAPH=OFF,REPORTGRAPH=OFF,MULT=10,
    MEASURED:
    .540_OD:0.0000,
    ADD
    DATUMS/REPORTDATUMSIZE=OFF,
    B(DATUM_B_CIR):NOM=0.25,+Tol=0.005,-Tol=0.005,
    FEATURES/.540_OD,,
    
    COMMENT/REPT,
    Actual location of above feature
    
    DIM LOC2= LOCATION OF CIRCLE .540_OD UNITS=IN ,$
    GRAPH=OFF TEXT=OFF MULT=10.00 OUTPUT=BOTH HALF ANGLE=NO
    AX MEAS NOMINAL +TOL -TOL MAX MIN DEV OUTTOL
    X -0.0050 0.0000 0.0050 0.0050 0.2646 -0.2748 -0.0050 0.0000 <--------
    Y -0.0013 0.0000 0.0050 0.0050 0.2682 -0.2708 -0.0013 0.0000 ---#-----
    D 0.5392 0.5400 0.0050 0.0050 0.0000 0.0000 -0.0008 0.0000 ---#-----
    END OF DIMENSION LOC2
    
    COMMENT/REPT,
    True position using legacy dimensions:
    
    DIM LOC3= POSITION OF CIRCLE .540_OD UNITS=IN ,$
    GRAPH=OFF TEXT=OFF MULT=10.00 OUTPUT=BOTH FIT TO DATUMS=OFF DEV PERPEN CENTERLINE=OFF DISPLAY=DIAMETER
    AX MEAS NOMINAL +TOL -TOL BONUS DEV OUTTOL
    X -0.0050 0.0000 -0.0050
    Y -0.0013 0.0000 -0.0013
    DF 0.5392 0.5400 0.0040 0.0040 0.0032 -0.0008 0.0000 ---#-----
    TP 0.0104 LMC 0.0000 0.0032 0.0104 0.0072 -------->
    END OF DIMENSION LOC3
    
    COMMENT/REPT,
    (23) .002 FLATNESS OF DATUM A (C2)
    
    DIM FLAT1= FLATNESS OF PLANE DATUM_A UNITS=IN ,$
    GRAPH=OFF TEXT=OFF MULT=10.00 ARROWDENSITY=100 OUTPUT=BOTH
    AX MEAS NOMINAL +TOL -TOL MAX MIN DEV OUTTOL
    M 0.0026 0.0000 0.0020 0.0000 0.0017 -0.0009 0.0026 0.0006 -------->
    
    COMMENT/REPT,
    (30) .008 PERPENDICULARITY TO DATUM A (B3)
    
    DIM PERP1= PERPENDICULARITY OF CYLINDER DATUM_B_CYL,RFS TO PLANE DATUM_A,RFS EXTENDLENGTH=0.0000 UNITS=IN ,$
    GRAPH=OFF TEXT=OFF MULT=10.00 OUTPUT=BOTH
    AX MEAS NOMINAL +TOL -TOL MAX MIN DEV OUTTOL
    M 0.0003 0.0000 0.0080 0.0000 0.0001 -0.0001 0.0003 0.0000 #--------
    
    MOVE/POINT,NORMAL,<0,-.3,0.42>
    
    TOP =FEAT/CONTACT/VECTOR POINT/DEFAULT,CARTESIAN
    THEO/<0,0,0.29>,<0,0,1>
    ACTL/<0.0004,-0.0003,0.2951>,<0,0,1>
    TARG/<0,0,0.29>,<0,0,1>
    SNAP=NO
    SHOW FEATURE PARAMETERS=NO
    SHOW CONTACT PARAMETERS=NO
    
    COMMENT/REPT,
    (33) .290 LINEAR DIMENSION ± .010 (C3)
    DIM DIST2= 3D DISTANCE FROM PLANE DATUM_A TO POINT TOP,SHORTEST=OFF,NO_RADIUS UNITS=IN,$
    GRAPH=OFF TEXT=OFF MULT=10.00 OUTPUT=BOTH
    AX MEAS NOMINAL +TOL -TOL MAX MIN DEV OUTTOL
    M 0.2951 0.2900 0.0100 0.0100 0.2951 0.2951 0.0051 0.0000 ------#--
    ReportSnapShot.JPG

  • #2
    Not sure about your problem, but you don't define any rotation...
    And in A1, you don't level on z...
    Maybe LMC Ø0 should explain ? (no, sorry, I forgot a zero between dev and tol... )

    Comment


    • jlgadrow
      jlgadrow commented
      Editing a comment
      The part is basically a cylinder sitting on another cylinder, so there isn't anything to rotate to. I assume that in A1, leveling on Z isn't really necessary since I do it in the AB_ALIGN, which is where the program stays through the end... I can try adding a level there to see if it changes anything...

      update: it did not.
      Last edited by jlgadrow; 04-23-2021, 01:22 PM.

  • #3
    TLDR, but things to try to get it to match the legacy

    turn off MMC/MMB/fit-to-datums anything that gives any bonus or datum shift (this is what I think it will be, it's the datum shift)
    sigpic
    Originally posted by AndersI
    I've got one from September 2006 (bug ticket) which has finally been fixed in 2013.

    Comment


    • jlgadrow
      jlgadrow commented
      Editing a comment
      I tried this and it does not seem to change the discrepancy from one method to the other.
      I also just noticed that even the measured diameters do not correlate from legacy to ... non-legacy? methods of reporting.

    • Matthew D. Hoedeman
      Matthew D. Hoedeman commented
      Editing a comment
      feature ID starts with a period, that's a no-no. LETTERS, NUMBERS, and the underscore only in ANY label, be it a feature, dimension, variable, etc.

    • jlgadrow
      jlgadrow commented
      Editing a comment
      The only time it ever gives me grief is when I'm using variables. Nonetheless, I renamed the features, ran the part again and got the same result...

  • #4
    I notice every alignment Recalls Startup, Does this program actually run? there's only one instance you recall a different alignment and that's a1. In your last alignment try recalling MAN_ALIGN. It's like you establish a feature then say nevermind.
    Last edited by KIRBSTER269; 04-23-2021, 02:25 PM.
    (In Memory of my Loving wife, "Ronda" who I lost March 7, 2016. I love you baby.)
    They say "Nobody's Perfect." I must be Nobody.

    Comment


    • jlgadrow
      jlgadrow commented
      Editing a comment
      The program runs without any issues. A1 recalls a different alignment because it's the only one that isn't overwriting every aspect of the previous alignment. That being said, I made the update you suggested and still no change in the results...

  • #5
    a lot of times i use a constructed alignment plane to rotate, and it does help for me

    Comment


    • #6
      Your diameters have different measurements (0.4644 vs 0.4651), so MMC will be different. Change it to Least Squared instead of Default. Also, you have MMB on the Datum for Geometric Tolerances. Turn off MMB on Geo Tol and see if you get the same deviations. You are most likely experiencing datum shift.
      Last edited by bfire85; 04-23-2021, 03:27 PM.

      Comment


      • jlgadrow
        jlgadrow commented
        Editing a comment
        We have a winner! Changing from default to least squares finally made a difference. The only problem with turning off MMB on the datum is that's how it is called out on the print, so is there a way to "turn off" datum shift without using RFS on the datum?

    • #7
      I never have used the GEO Tolerance thingy, but I use Xact and I would assume it's the same way. If you bring it up (EDIT) the callout, click the dropbox where it says ASME Y14.5 there it says 3 options, ASME, or ISO or Custom, Click on Custom, go to the NOMINALS tab at the top and on that screen you should see 2 boxes Perpendicular to centerline and Fit to DATUMS. untick Fit to Datums hit ok and refresh your report.
      Last edited by KIRBSTER269; 04-24-2021, 11:21 AM.
      (In Memory of my Loving wife, "Ronda" who I lost March 7, 2016. I love you baby.)
      They say "Nobody's Perfect." I must be Nobody.

      Comment

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